Thereās a guy on our dog walking route that put up several Trump flags last year. My wife and I actually wound up having an interaction with him because he was spying on us through his cameras and got mad that we referred to the flags as embarrassing and said that Trumpism was a cult.
By mid-April, heād pulled down all the flagpoles and didnāt even take the flags off them, just laid the poles with flags wrapped around them in the dirt by his driveway.
In May I actually talked with him. Initially I had no intention of trying to be nice to him - he just had done something sort of shitty a few days before (encouraging his dog to bark at our dogs). I was going to be like āLook, if you wanna call me gay slurs over your ring camera, thatās fine, but donāt encourage your dog to be hostile to mine.ā
But somehow he tied his dog to military service, and while I was fully prepared to connect the lack of a veteran license plate to his statement to call him a liar and a Reddit ninja, he fielded the license plate question and said that heād suffered a TBI that resulted in an appreciable percentage of brain dying, and that made him unable to be rational when he felt any sort of threat or insult. So he didnāt use the military plates, because heād had negative experiences with motorists while using them.
I donāt know if I believe that - it seems dumb on the part of the other motorists. But Iām not willing to keep pressing for the sake of picking a fight. Iāll throw a barb, but not over-extend myself. Itās just not worth it.
So I listened, and we chatted - for like an hour and a half. My wife left after a few minutes with the dogs. We talked about politics, the world, our community, and how fucked everything is. He supported Trump because of the 2016 (Obama) economy. He believes in womenās rights. He is conservative, anti-immigrant, and believes in stronger policing. I told him I believe in increased social support, so folks like him can get out of the VA benefits trap. I told him I think the way to stronger communities is through stronger schools and increased civic engagement - more pride, less punishment. He even asked if weād be willing to help train his dog better, because he notices that ours donāt bark at other dogs, and donāt pull on their leads. I told him Iād have to think about it, and ask my wife, since sheās the one who really had the patience to get our dogs where they are.
We parted - not as friends - but certainly not as enemies. Just - neighbors with a better understanding of each other.
Boss, as a vet, I also donāt have vet plates. In my case, It continues to feel like pulling military benefits when I did the bare minimum as a job when the market was shit. I donāt like pulling veteranās discounts at restaurants/stores/etc. either.
Thatās fair. To be honest, the thing that sort of put me back on my heels about him was learning about the TBI - that explained his pattern of behavior. However, I can definitely see the point about not wanting the recognition via the license plate, or the reminders of harder times.
After months of a mostly one-way back and forth, I really just was looking to poke back at him and was grasping at low-hanging fruit in the moment. Kinda glad I saw an alternative option once it opened up.
Not about earned. If theyāre thevkind of boot lickers who want to go down on you for desperate youthful dabbling with imperialism, i would really rather they not have it.
Tithe the savings to amnesty international or something, if you feel guilty. Itās not about you having. Not that im opposed; you seem fine.
Possibly even āBest of Lemmyā material. This story took me for an emotional ride, and the ending provided water to the wilting sprig thatās left of my hope.
ETA I just decided to go for it. Letās see what Lemmy decides.
My boyfriend keeps saying that America needs a strong leader who can unite the people across the political divide like Lincoln did. That Trump was a divider for all people and he spreads divisiveness and hate whereever he goes and that most of the divisiveness we have today is because of Trump. He took smaller issues and poured gasoline on them and now we are here.
He says the way out of this nightmare is not a violent revolution, but a leader who can unite the people and bring focus back to building a society that is better for all.
He doesnāt want Americans to lose their humanity because of one insane asshole. I am sometimes in awe of his cold head and warm heart. I try to remind myself of his words whenever I hear the next new retarded thing Trump has done overseas and how itās gonna affect not just America but the rest of us too. I go a bit feral sometimes, ngl.
Do you know the longest Iāve gone in the past week without hearing a flashbang in the distance? Thats because people are asking them to stop. I dont think itās working.
A strong leader who can unite across the political divide. Reading full sentences matters. You can cherry pick any part of any sentence and twist it into whatever you want if your attitude is to not actually engage with a comment, but just to smugly point and roll your eyes at things.
For what it is worth, I personally have a hard time seeing how things wonāt get violent in the end, but I just wanted to share my awe of my boyfriendās ability to hold on to these values even when things are burning. I think it is admirable because Iām not like that myself.
And please stop yourself with your āoh honeyā. What a belittling way to engage with someone.
The rest of the sentence really doesnāt matter. What you want him to do is like the ābutā in āIām not racist butā. Great man theory jacking off authoritarian models always leads the same place, and that place is fiume.
youāre a thoroughly unpleasant condescending bucket of ass
Well yes, but in my defense, only an idiot would look up right now.
hold onto these values
Iām not sure the values he holds are the same ones youāre reading. I dont have ejough data ro say itherwise for sure, but be careful about that. Iāve seen a lot of straight girls accept some fucked up shit and ruin their god damn lives because the fields were so barren, and this gives me āterrible menā shivers.
Trump not only poured gasoline and lit the match, but he proved that outrage politics work. He proved that itās ok to be blatantly dishonest, immoral, and corrupt, and there were no consequences. He proved you can ignore the Constitution and legal restrictions.
And others in his party have copied that approach, and also found it working (admittedly to a smaller extent). I donāt see this approach going away
It works, yes and there probably always will be people out there who fall for it, but somethings gotta give eventually. We managed to build societies that were comparatively more stable than this and we can do it again. We have been through this shit thousands of times as a species.
My boyfriend keeps saying that America needs a strong leader who can unite the people across the political divide like Lincoln did.
I think your boyfriend needs to read a history bookā¦ Two of the most famous events of Lincolnās presidency are the only Civil War in the US has ever had, and him getting shot in the back of the head by the opposition.
Not saying either of those are Lincolnās fault necessarilyā¦
You may want to ask yourself why Lincoln was shot and what the civil war was about and who started it and why? You may want to look into what Lincolns actions were throughout his presidency.
I can give you a hint: he was trying to unify people across political divides and disagreements and he is largely known for being the president who ended slavery and unified the USA. Whenever I have heard about Lincoln, that is what I have heard way before his assassination and the civil war and I have never stepped foot in America.
To boil Lincoln down to only being known for the civil war and his own assassination at best shows bad faith and at worst a terrible lack of understanding of your own history, in case you are an American yourself.
Yes I am an American. An American whoās great great grandfather marched his ass from Indiana down to the bottom of Georgia. In the late 1860s. An American who spent a week each summer following that path with his grandfather and visiting battle sites.
My argument was not that Lincoln didnāt try to keep the country together. I was just pointing out the irony of calling for a strong leader to bring the country together, and then picking the one president who was in charge when the country split and went to war. It wasnāt Lincoln reaching across the aisle that kept the country together. It was Sherman chasing the confederates to the ocean and burning everything behind him. They were stuck with two options, and the confederates picked the one that didnāt involve swimming for the rest of their lives.
Okay, so youāre just going to completely ignore everything I said and cherry pick me quoting you. What is with you people?
Lincoln was the one to make the difficult decisions to do away with an inhumane practice among other things and he wanted a united America. He did pretty much all the dirty work when the country was the most divided and least harmonious. Anyone who came after him and continued the work he started is a valid president in his own right, but Lincoln was the base for that future and part of why he is so remembered.
I still stand by that Lincoln isnāt mostly known for the Civil War and getting shot. That may be true to you, but where I live and by most people who knows about him, he is famous for being the president who ended slavery and stood up against a cruel practice that had been protected and encouraged by the government for ages before him.
I do not understand why you are so insistent on poo-pooing on his legacy and ignoring the points I made. You donāt know your own history.
I am genuinely shocked at how so many of you are completely ignorant to history and the context within.
This would be like me smugly crossing my arms and concluding that all the people who tried to make things better during ww2 were somehow shitty people and/or less important figures than those who came after because they had to step up during hard times.
Do you people think that good leaders only count when things are going swimmingly? Are you going to blame whomever comes after trump, who will try to fix things, for the shit trump did?
My amygdala hates that that seems the most effective way out of all this. A lot of people are lost and angry and get mad when they feel threatened. Some, sure, are evil as evil can be for the sheer joy of cruelty. But plenty are small and angry and dont think anything can be better so they lash out and follow the strongmen.
The dead wonāt care why they did it or that they change. But those who live because they change might just care that they do.
All I know is fuck I got tired being the only [slur] a bunch of rural republicans ever met, and Iām fucking pissed I had to leave for the reason I did.
The really funny thing is that Iām in a heterosexual couple. My wife is bi, but the closest I tread to the rainbow is polyamory.
Itās not even a good insult! Oooh. Iām going to associate you with a group that has shown incredible resilience and generally embodies such dastardly values as embracing their true selves, seeking or building community, respecting each other, valuing mental health and self care, and living in defiance of what is expected of them.
Iāve been given more insulting compliments.
I think fixing their shit isnāt our place. It kind of canāt be.
Id really rather spend twenty hours talking to a thoroughly unpleasant piece of shit than half that staring through a scope and pissing into a bag, or twenty minutes cleaning the guillotine. I honestly would.
And sometimes it works. I guess. But usually itās a waste of time. We donāt have much of that left. And we mostly arenāt the people they would be able to hear. I fucking hate this shit. Iām fucking great at talking to awful pieces of shit, i post fucking recreationally (no offense, dear reader. I donāt mean youĀ¹)
Thereās a guy on our dog walking route that put up several Trump flags last year. My wife and I actually wound up having an interaction with him because he was spying on us through his cameras and got mad that we referred to the flags as embarrassing and said that Trumpism was a cult.
By mid-April, heād pulled down all the flagpoles and didnāt even take the flags off them, just laid the poles with flags wrapped around them in the dirt by his driveway.
In May I actually talked with him. Initially I had no intention of trying to be nice to him - he just had done something sort of shitty a few days before (encouraging his dog to bark at our dogs). I was going to be like āLook, if you wanna call me gay slurs over your ring camera, thatās fine, but donāt encourage your dog to be hostile to mine.ā
But somehow he tied his dog to military service, and while I was fully prepared to connect the lack of a veteran license plate to his statement to call him a liar and a Reddit ninja, he fielded the license plate question and said that heād suffered a TBI that resulted in an appreciable percentage of brain dying, and that made him unable to be rational when he felt any sort of threat or insult. So he didnāt use the military plates, because heād had negative experiences with motorists while using them.
I donāt know if I believe that - it seems dumb on the part of the other motorists. But Iām not willing to keep pressing for the sake of picking a fight. Iāll throw a barb, but not over-extend myself. Itās just not worth it.
So I listened, and we chatted - for like an hour and a half. My wife left after a few minutes with the dogs. We talked about politics, the world, our community, and how fucked everything is. He supported Trump because of the 2016 (Obama) economy. He believes in womenās rights. He is conservative, anti-immigrant, and believes in stronger policing. I told him I believe in increased social support, so folks like him can get out of the VA benefits trap. I told him I think the way to stronger communities is through stronger schools and increased civic engagement - more pride, less punishment. He even asked if weād be willing to help train his dog better, because he notices that ours donāt bark at other dogs, and donāt pull on their leads. I told him Iād have to think about it, and ask my wife, since sheās the one who really had the patience to get our dogs where they are.
We parted - not as friends - but certainly not as enemies. Just - neighbors with a better understanding of each other.
Boss, as a vet, I also donāt have vet plates. In my case, It continues to feel like pulling military benefits when I did the bare minimum as a job when the market was shit. I donāt like pulling veteranās discounts at restaurants/stores/etc. either.
Thatās fair. To be honest, the thing that sort of put me back on my heels about him was learning about the TBI - that explained his pattern of behavior. However, I can definitely see the point about not wanting the recognition via the license plate, or the reminders of harder times.
After months of a mostly one-way back and forth, I really just was looking to poke back at him and was grasping at low-hanging fruit in the moment. Kinda glad I saw an alternative option once it opened up.
If theyāre the kind of boit lickers that would go down on tou for it, take what you can.
That and āJust take it! Youāve already earned itā donāt really help the scummy feeling I get when applying it.
Not about earned. If theyāre thevkind of boot lickers who want to go down on you for desperate youthful dabbling with imperialism, i would really rather they not have it.
Tithe the savings to amnesty international or something, if you feel guilty. Itās not about you having. Not that im opposed; you seem fine.
Champion! What a great story
Possibly even āBest of Lemmyā material. This story took me for an emotional ride, and the ending provided water to the wilting sprig thatās left of my hope.
ETA I just decided to go for it. Letās see what Lemmy decides.
My boyfriend keeps saying that America needs a strong leader who can unite the people across the political divide like Lincoln did. That Trump was a divider for all people and he spreads divisiveness and hate whereever he goes and that most of the divisiveness we have today is because of Trump. He took smaller issues and poured gasoline on them and now we are here.
He says the way out of this nightmare is not a violent revolution, but a leader who can unite the people and bring focus back to building a society that is better for all.
He doesnāt want Americans to lose their humanity because of one insane asshole. I am sometimes in awe of his cold head and warm heart. I try to remind myself of his words whenever I hear the next new retarded thing Trump has done overseas and how itās gonna affect not just America but the rest of us too. I go a bit feral sometimes, ngl.
Soā¦
Little late on that
Do you know the longest Iāve gone in the past week without hearing a flashbang in the distance? Thats because people are asking them to stop. I dont think itās working.
Oh honeyā¦
A strong leader who can unite across the political divide. Reading full sentences matters. You can cherry pick any part of any sentence and twist it into whatever you want if your attitude is to not actually engage with a comment, but just to smugly point and roll your eyes at things.
For what it is worth, I personally have a hard time seeing how things wonāt get violent in the end, but I just wanted to share my awe of my boyfriendās ability to hold on to these values even when things are burning. I think it is admirable because Iām not like that myself.
And please stop yourself with your āoh honeyā. What a belittling way to engage with someone.
The rest of the sentence really doesnāt matter. What you want him to do is like the ābutā in āIām not racist butā. Great man theory jacking off authoritarian models always leads the same place, and that place is fiume.
Well yes, but in my defense, only an idiot would look up right now.
Iām not sure the values he holds are the same ones youāre reading. I dont have ejough data ro say itherwise for sure, but be careful about that. Iāve seen a lot of straight girls accept some fucked up shit and ruin their god damn lives because the fields were so barren, and this gives me āterrible menā shivers.
The problem is the flock of Trump-wannabes.
Trump not only poured gasoline and lit the match, but he proved that outrage politics work. He proved that itās ok to be blatantly dishonest, immoral, and corrupt, and there were no consequences. He proved you can ignore the Constitution and legal restrictions.
And others in his party have copied that approach, and also found it working (admittedly to a smaller extent). I donāt see this approach going away
It works, yes and there probably always will be people out there who fall for it, but somethings gotta give eventually. We managed to build societies that were comparatively more stable than this and we can do it again. We have been through this shit thousands of times as a species.
I think your boyfriend needs to read a history bookā¦ Two of the most famous events of Lincolnās presidency are the only Civil War in the US has ever had, and him getting shot in the back of the head by the opposition.
Not saying either of those are Lincolnās fault necessarilyā¦
You may want to ask yourself why Lincoln was shot and what the civil war was about and who started it and why? You may want to look into what Lincolns actions were throughout his presidency.
I can give you a hint: he was trying to unify people across political divides and disagreements and he is largely known for being the president who ended slavery and unified the USA. Whenever I have heard about Lincoln, that is what I have heard way before his assassination and the civil war and I have never stepped foot in America.
To boil Lincoln down to only being known for the civil war and his own assassination at best shows bad faith and at worst a terrible lack of understanding of your own history, in case you are an American yourself.
Relevant text quoted.
Yes I am an American. An American whoās great great grandfather marched his ass from Indiana down to the bottom of Georgia. In the late 1860s. An American who spent a week each summer following that path with his grandfather and visiting battle sites.
My argument was not that Lincoln didnāt try to keep the country together. I was just pointing out the irony of calling for a strong leader to bring the country together, and then picking the one president who was in charge when the country split and went to war. It wasnāt Lincoln reaching across the aisle that kept the country together. It was Sherman chasing the confederates to the ocean and burning everything behind him. They were stuck with two options, and the confederates picked the one that didnāt involve swimming for the rest of their lives.
Okay, so youāre just going to completely ignore everything I said and cherry pick me quoting you. What is with you people?
Lincoln was the one to make the difficult decisions to do away with an inhumane practice among other things and he wanted a united America. He did pretty much all the dirty work when the country was the most divided and least harmonious. Anyone who came after him and continued the work he started is a valid president in his own right, but Lincoln was the base for that future and part of why he is so remembered.
I still stand by that Lincoln isnāt mostly known for the Civil War and getting shot. That may be true to you, but where I live and by most people who knows about him, he is famous for being the president who ended slavery and stood up against a cruel practice that had been protected and encouraged by the government for ages before him.
I do not understand why you are so insistent on poo-pooing on his legacy and ignoring the points I made. You donāt know your own history.
Lincoln was president during what historians refer to as āThe Really Nice Timesā
I am genuinely shocked at how so many of you are completely ignorant to history and the context within. This would be like me smugly crossing my arms and concluding that all the people who tried to make things better during ww2 were somehow shitty people and/or less important figures than those who came after because they had to step up during hard times.
Do you people think that good leaders only count when things are going swimmingly? Are you going to blame whomever comes after trump, who will try to fix things, for the shit trump did?
My amygdala hates that that seems the most effective way out of all this. A lot of people are lost and angry and get mad when they feel threatened. Some, sure, are evil as evil can be for the sheer joy of cruelty. But plenty are small and angry and dont think anything can be better so they lash out and follow the strongmen.
The dead wonāt care why they did it or that they change. But those who live because they change might just care that they do.
All I know is fuck I got tired being the only [slur] a bunch of rural republicans ever met, and Iām fucking pissed I had to leave for the reason I did.
The really funny thing is that Iām in a heterosexual couple. My wife is bi, but the closest I tread to the rainbow is polyamory.
Itās not even a good insult!
Oooh. Iām going to associate you with a group that has shown incredible resilience and generally embodies such dastardly values as embracing their true selves, seeking or building community, respecting each other, valuing mental health and self care, and living in defiance of what is expected of them.
Iāve been given more insulting compliments.
I think fixing their shit isnāt our place. It kind of canāt be.
Id really rather spend twenty hours talking to a thoroughly unpleasant piece of shit than half that staring through a scope and pissing into a bag, or twenty minutes cleaning the guillotine. I honestly would.
And sometimes it works. I guess. But usually itās a waste of time. We donāt have much of that left. And we mostly arenāt the people they would be able to hear. I fucking hate this shit. Iām fucking great at talking to awful pieces of shit, i post fucking recreationally (no offense, dear reader. I donāt mean youĀ¹)
Ā¹yes. Yes i do.